tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post3687886045945067608..comments2024-03-28T11:21:19.200-04:00Comments on The Gossips of Rivertown: A Gossips Guest EssayCarole Osterinkhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16010623982526286408noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-63953300302977432432015-12-02T17:07:19.446-05:002015-12-02T17:07:19.446-05:00Thank you all for your comments. Don Moore and Ma...Thank you all for your comments. Don Moore and Mark Orton wondered what we can do to improve schools and I would suggest: more of this dialogue. <br /><br />There are really two big questions facing educators and education policymakers (which is us): What works? and How do we implement what works? <br /><br />The first is fairly easy to answer. There are good schools all over the country and they are good because they do some basic things right. (I wrote about some of them in Ohio here: http://edexcellence.net/publications/needles-in-a-haystack-1.html.) Steve Dunn has suggested one of the keys to such success—good teachers. Other key ingredients include a coherent, content-rich curriculum; a well-managed and safe environment; intense and constant collaboration; and a culture of excellence. Put those ingredients in a well-stirred pot and issues of poverty and parents all but disappear. Tom Gavin did this when he ran the alternative learning program out of the trailers behind the old Greenport School. <br /><br />But how you make this happen in this balkanized education world is tough. One thing that would help, in my opinion, is community commitment to education. We really need to get ourselves educated about our schools. Such knowledge should come before argument and it should include the kind of research Mr. Dunn alluded to. It includes, for instance, reading a book called The Schools We Need: And Why We Don’t Have Them, by E.D. Hirsch, arguably the single-best book about education written in the last 50 years. <br /><br />The point is that the more knowledge the community has, the more invested it is in the outcomes and the better our education system. Here are some ideas:<br /><br />• We need a fulltime education reporter, either at one of our existing media outlets or some new outlet. The emphasis here is fulltime, someone who can cover education in depth and breadth, who will not only report on the Perfect 10 opening at the Opera House but also on the Curriculum Workshop sponsored by the HCSD BOE. By expanding the meaning of “education” to include the rich offerings from our gifted non-profit education and arts organizations as well as the day-to-day readin’-ritin’-rithmetic sloggings of our district teachers, we would begin to see the educational endeavor as a community responsibility. <br />• Our local towns (and cities) need school liaisons, someone dedicated to staying informed about our schools and lobbying for their town’s children. Our town-and-gown problem was summed up beautifully by Hudson native and former Hudson City Youth Department Commissioner Danny Grandinetti who once said, “I can throw a baseball from Oakdale to the Middle School, but I have no communication with the school district.” <br />• Our local business, fraternal, and church organizations should have school liaisons as well. <br /><br />The health of our community depends on our schools. And once we start understanding how they work and begin to act as if we own them, we’ll start to get the schools our children deserve.<br /><br /> <br /><br /><br />Peter Meyerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12627451247693034161noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-14620498117621058012015-12-02T08:20:39.294-05:002015-12-02T08:20:39.294-05:00Having worked for theHCSD I can tell you there are...Having worked for theHCSD I can tell you there are many students 10th grade and up that can't tell time on an analog clock, have great difficulty reading and comprehending and can nearly spell and write but are pushed alongAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07256316946319272765noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-53037715814244267662015-11-30T17:44:32.220-05:002015-11-30T17:44:32.220-05:00I would like to tag along with Don Moore's que...I would like to tag along with Don Moore's question of how do we go about changing the situation. In addition, are there factors beyond the school walls that can be brought to bear on the school, its teachers and, I suspect most importantly, the students and their families?<br /><br />Mark OrtonMarkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17114425060306979419noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-68995964839422081842015-11-30T16:51:43.266-05:002015-11-30T16:51:43.266-05:00I'm afraid that the HCSD results speak for the...I'm afraid that the HCSD results speak for themselves. The rest are just excuses. Katherine@onlyobelisks.comhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01340413319840338775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-26755662906112518542015-11-30T14:19:33.851-05:002015-11-30T14:19:33.851-05:00I have long been of the belief that the most criti...I have long been of the belief that the most critical factor in educational performance, particularly among children whose parents have relatively low social economic status, is the quality of the teachers. The rest is mostly noise. To do that, there needs to be a professional career track, where excellent teachers over time, are paid very well - in the six figures - and low quality teachers are removed. That means, having substantial pay differentials among teachers, something the teachers' unions vehemently oppose. Until that changes, I don't expect to see much improvement, which is a tragedy for this nation. It suggests that our future is one of increasing income inequality, with all of the attendant social stress that portends. The US does a great job teaching the elite, and has most of the best institutions of higher education in the world, while some of the worst secondary schools among the industrialized nations. <br /><br />I don't mind paying a lot of taxes to finance secondary schools that do a good job. I do mind paying such taxes for those that do not. Hudson unfortunately seems to be an exemplar of the latter category. <br /><br />Googling around, I found the link below to an article about the impact on teacher quality on educational performance. I cannot vouch for its credibility, but hey, it's a professor from Stanford University, one of those elite institutions to which I referred, for what it is worth. <br /><br />http://hanushek.stanford.edu/publications/valuing-teachers-how-much-good-teacher-worthSteve Dunnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04588935402322108968noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-62602535180761715232015-11-30T12:37:54.292-05:002015-11-30T12:37:54.292-05:00Tom Gavin, Retired Principal HCSD
You are correct...Tom Gavin, Retired Principal HCSD<br /><br />You are correct Mr. Friedman. BOCES is funded by local school districts who use their services. <br />The "window dressing" you mention is a vital aspect, according to central administration, for the district. The montra over the yeasr is that "perception is reality." I disagreed with this phiosophy for years because it's intent is to present a picture that is not reality to the community. <br /><br />A perfect example of this was the announcement made the Superintendents Conference day that 2 students graduated from the bridge program. That's all well and good but the 14 drop outs were never mentioned at all. It's also reflected in the Superintendes BOE meeting assignment of telling only of "what's right with the district." <br /><br />There are many more examples but the horse is already dead so why keep beating it?<br /><br /> Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-36801527063530420932015-11-30T11:02:30.804-05:002015-11-30T11:02:30.804-05:00Peter you make the point that BOCES is a separate ...Peter you make the point that BOCES is a separate legal entity from the HCSD and I believe this is correct. But isn't it a distinction without a difference viz. funding? BOCES itself doesn't levy a tax. Isn't it funded from contributions from the districts that are "cooperating" in BOCES' existence? And isn't the HCSD's portion of the BOCES budget paid out of the funds it receives from its levy? And doesn't the HCSD have reps on the "board" part of BOCES?<br /><br />The problem isn't a sign, per se, of course. Rather, it's what the sign, er, signifies: a disconnect between the educational institutions in the community and the community itself. While failing to graduate a huge percentage of its charges, the local educational institutions feel justified in spending time and money on window dressing. This is not acceptable to many here in the community. We may not be educational experts, but we are imbued with both common sense and some wisdom. Not to mention with a bill for $45m a year that we manage to pay. How does a failing system justify spending its professionals' time and our money on that sign, or a new gym, when it is not even close to performing basic services we pay it to perform?<br /><br />Anyone from the HCSD wish to chime in here or is the community, once again, whistling in the dark?John K. Friedmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14071150738374309103noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-67317376993421049912015-11-30T10:50:50.883-05:002015-11-30T10:50:50.883-05:00The HCSD injects $45m into the local economy?! I ...The HCSD injects $45m into the local economy?! I think not: it takes $45m out of the local economy -- the bulk of its spending is on compensation for the faculty and staff, many of whom don't live in Hudson; it spends for retirement outlays (current payments to retirees who are often likely living somewhere else) and and for contributions towards future retirement obligations (by investing on markets that are not located in Hudson where there are a mere handful of local companies none of which have a significant share float or trading volume); it buys food from somewhere (does any come from Col. Co. farms?); it buys books and supplies from companies that aren't located here. So how much of that $45m is spent locally? Not a lot.<br />John K. Friedmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14071150738374309103noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-86599171358835599332015-11-29T23:15:11.800-05:002015-11-29T23:15:11.800-05:00Don Moore submitted this addendum to his comment:
...Don Moore submitted this addendum to his comment:<br /><br />.to continue: I would like a dialogue about the species our our school board. Who runs what? Where are the power centers? Can arguments be successfully employed that describe the purposes of the schools sufficient to overcome self-Interest.Carole Osterinkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16010623982526286408noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-61299583092867065702015-11-29T22:27:23.513-05:002015-11-29T22:27:23.513-05:00Peter's description of the forces at work nati...Peter's description of the forces at work nationally, and with a certainty, locally is really valuable and welcome. What I wish were incorporated are some recommendation on what could usefully be done to change the situation in the HCSD for the better.<br /><br />Peter offers dialogue as the beginning point on the path to improvement. Very well. But something is missing, for me, in Peter's analysis. It may be this. Does the answer lie in analyzing how the forces Peter describes effect the array of social, cultural, economic and financial dynamics end up as disincentives for children in our school system. examining and understanding our peculiar array of forces is where we should start with our dialogue. Don Moorehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05123927706785693239noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-28497356300160508142015-11-29T18:43:56.722-05:002015-11-29T18:43:56.722-05:00memo to peter meyer,
without really knowing it, ...memo to peter meyer, <br /><br />without really knowing it, peter, you pretty much stated the problem with the BOE and the managers of the failed school system in hudson.<br /><br />it is not supposed to be an economic engine putting money into everyones pockets, to the tune of 45 million dollars. as you stated. <br /><br />It is NOT a good thing to spend that much. You didnt say that the people paid to teach, whose duty it is to provide good education, have not delivered in any way.<br /><br />perhaps the intentions to do a good job are there with some people, but the reality is in the performance numbers. hudson is at the bottom of the pile. <br /><br />45 million spent has not delivered to the students -- and it is a disservice to the community. <br /><br />sometimes much less spent with a conscience goes much further. lets reduce the spending to 30 million. <br />maybe that would be better. j kayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08669649380477390089noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-29558784129549054512015-11-29T17:49:24.276-05:002015-11-29T17:49:24.276-05:00well said!well said!chris gilbertnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5723709701684173708.post-37697523103870531722015-11-29T16:52:15.965-05:002015-11-29T16:52:15.965-05:00The following came through anonymously as a commen...The following came through anonymously as a comment on the post about Alan Chartock's conversation with Roberta Gratz. The content, however, makes it clear that it was meant to be a comment about the guest essay and also persuaded me to relax the rules about having to sign comments if you choose "Anonymous" as your profile.<br /><br />Danny and Carolyn O'Neil of O'Neil's Florist (Hudson and Chatham) were among those shop keepers who employed several HHS students, year round. They were as interested in our academic pursuits, our participation in sports, our involvement with Yearbook and The Owl, as our parents. They expected us to succeed, to excel, not just to pass. They celebrated with cake or fondue, our successes, and chided us when we didn't live up to our God given potential. There were no "participation" trophies then.<br /><br />Mrs. O'Neil had been a HHS Valedictorian, and reminded all of us there was an entire world out there, that was just waiting for us. <br /><br />In the meantime, however, we were all expected to be able to read and write, add and subtract, make change accurately every single time (using pen and paper) take down directions correctly, pre-GPSes, be attentive and polite to customers, be on time and stay until the last order was filled, school night or not.<br /><br />It mattered to Danny and Carolyn, just like it mattered to our parents.<br /><br />Peter, I would add one name to the list of Administrators who cared deeply about the success of the HCSD: David Paciencia. He cared not a wit about the politics of it, or the personalities; he wanted results. He initiated the Dollars for Scholars program; sent out timely and informative newsletters; and as a result of his thoughtful and tenacious determination, Crosswinds served as a temporary home to the Alternative School Program.<br /><br />Your piece here Peter is mandatory reading - perhaps out loud, as a group - for the currently seated School Board. <br /><br />You keep us all honest. Carole Osterinkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16010623982526286408noreply@blogger.com